Light After Life

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A Case Against Reincarnation

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Candlelight
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A Case Against Reincarnation

Post by Candlelight on 10th September 2017, 14:32

The decades of the sixties and seventies planted for many people the seeds of a spiritual quest for greater awareness and an understanding of the meaning of life. I was one of those caught up by this awakening and, in 1969, left my Midwestern roots and went to California. There I discovered a new lifestyle - practicing yoga, meditating, reading philosophy and becoming a vegetarian. In the seventies, Los Angeles was a bastion of spirituality and the Hindu concepts of karma and reincarnation were taught everywhere. I accepted these beliefs without question, until one day my at a psychic reading I experienced something that compelled me to begin to wonder.
Read more:  http://www.spiritsintheroom.com/

The above is an excerpt from the writings of Alan Ross (Spiritualism and Beyond).

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Re: A Case Against Reincarnation

Post by mac on 10th September 2017, 21:13

Mildly interested and without having read further, should the title be 'spiritualism and beyond', lower case 's' not Modern Spiritualism, the philosophy etc.....?

Strike that.  I took a look after all.  The strike-throughs are all mine.

"Although reincarnation may be considered the philosophical cornerstone of Hinduism, Buddhism and the New Age Movement, it is not officially recognized by Spiritualism. The major spiritualist associations do not include reincarnation as a tenant  tenet nor is it taught by their philosophy departments. This is because with every case of past life memory there is an equally reasonable alternative explanation, and the spiritualist Spiritualist conception is that reincarnation cannot be proven conclusively."

I think it's fair to say that Spiritualism doesn't accept that reincarnation is conclusively proven.  What I personally say is that Spiritualism also doesn't prove survival but there's overwhelming evidence it's the case.

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Re: A Case Against Reincarnation

Post by mac on 10th September 2017, 21:41

interesting website - a handy resource Smile   thank you
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Re: A Case Against Reincarnation

Post by Candlelight on 10th September 2017, 21:51

lol - You made your 'strike-through' edits just in time, as I was just about to scold you strongly about the "without having read further" bit!

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Re: A Case Against Reincarnation

Post by mac on 10th September 2017, 23:20

Yes I'm a bit of a monkey at times, a little irascible!!  very happy very happy



bnbnbnbn

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Re: A Case Against Reincarnation

Post by mac on 11th September 2017, 12:06

I've watched Part 1, Psychic.  When do we see Part 2?



bnbnbnbn
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Re: A Case Against Reincarnation

Post by Stardust on 15th September 2017, 17:52

Reincarnation does offer a certain attraction. It's like that film with Tom Hanks (Forrest Gump?) where he says life is like a box of chocolates.
The only way to understand what it's like for each person living in different situations on our planet, is to reincarnate so we can try them out for ourselves, leading to better understanding.

Why should our present life be the only one? Of course there's a risk we might end up in a bad life, but then we might get a good one.
Maybe we get to choose whether we want to reincarnate, and in what conditions...

Like most things about death, we don't know what happens, nothing can be proved one way or the other.

PS: Sorry but I only read the first bit of that article.  Embarassed   I didn't have time to read the rest (how many pages are there anyway?



A gentle whisper like the breeze sighing, so easy to miss, listen carefully...

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Re: A Case Against Reincarnation

Post by mac on 15th September 2017, 19:35

There is quite a large number of pages.

Reincarnation isn't proven but can't be disproved. It it happens it's likely to be different from what many believe to be the way it operates.

quote: "The only way to understand what it's like for each person living in different situations on our planet, is to reincarnate so we can try them out for ourselves, leading to better understanding." This is a flawed assertion. We can't ever know exactly how life is for any other individual - we're each unique hence so are the lives we each live. What we CAN do, however, is to learn vicariously from the experiences of others in our soul-group or soul-cell. We learn from our companions, they learn from us, based on one another's life experiences.

That way neither they, nor we individually, have to actually live a particular kind of life in order to gain its experiences and thereby enhance our own spiritual progression.
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Re: A Case Against Reincarnation

Post by Stardust on 19th September 2017, 10:12

I love our beautiful planet and all that Nature provides for us, unfortunately often spoilt by people abusing these wonderful gifts.

I shall be sad to leave it all behind.

I know, you're going to tell me that once I'm in the "Light" I won't want to return to Earth, but I shall still heave a heavy sigh and depart with some regret.



A gentle whisper like the breeze sighing, so easy to miss, listen carefully...

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Re: A Case Against Reincarnation

Post by mac on 19th September 2017, 12:50

@Stardust wrote:I love our beautiful planet and all that Nature provides for us, unfortunately often spoilt by people abusing these wonderful gifts.

I shall be sad to leave it all behind.

I know, you're going to tell me that once I'm in the "Light" I won't want to return to Earth, but I shall still heave a heavy sigh and depart with some regret.
I don't see how those comments relate to reincarnation as you haven't linked 'em to it in any way.  Nonetheless they're interesting points and as I've got nothing better to do I'll write a response.   pirat

I also love the planet we live on but I don't love the way humankind trashes it.  Nevertheless we're here for a reason so I have to accept it's all part of our overall spiritual progression.  If it ain't then all bets are off....

You're wrong about one point in your last paragraph - I'm not going to tell you how you'll feel after you kick off your clogs for the last time.   lolsign 

You may be bang on right about how you'll feel and who knows?  Some of us may feel similar.  But one thing is for certain.  You - we - don't know for sure how you or we will feel when the occasion eventually, inevitably, comes about.  

I suspect I will leave with a measure of regret because it's hard-wired in me that I'm not comfortable with change.  I expect I'll miss some of what's familiar and enjoyable (assuming I'm enjoying anything enjoyable at the point my time is up.) in this world but at the same time I'm expecting I'll enjoy getting back to where I used to live.  

That's how I see the most likely situation.   Wink
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Re: A Case Against Reincarnation

Post by Stardust on 20th September 2017, 08:53

@mac wrote:I don't see how those comments relate to reincarnation as you haven't linked 'em to it in any way.

... You - we - don't know for sure how you or we will feel when the occasion eventually, inevitably, comes about.  

Link to reincarnation is not evident since I was replying to your theory that it probably doesn't exist and indicating that, in that case, I would be sad to go knowing that no return was possible.

When the time comes I shall very likely be calm and accepting, nothing Earthly will seem important to me anymore since all, including loved ones, will fade into the background with a "This is it then, here I go...".

Getting back to reincarnation, it would have been nice to see whether folk who believe in it imagine that we could come back not only as human but perhaps instead as an animal, an insect, even a tree/plant, or whatever else?

I've always thought I would like to be the wind gently rustling through the leaves of a tree, or whipping up the ocean waves, or whistling through the night while the little children sleep on...

Who knows but that little spider the nasty man trod on might come back as human while Mr big foot would return as a spider... sweet karma.



A gentle whisper like the breeze sighing, so easy to miss, listen carefully...

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Re: A Case Against Reincarnation

Post by mac on 21st September 2017, 18:26

@Stardust wrote:
@mac wrote:I don't see how those comments relate to reincarnation as you haven't linked 'em to it in any way.

... You - we - don't know for sure how you or we will feel when the occasion eventually, inevitably, comes about.  

Link to reincarnation is not evident since I was replying to your theory that it probably doesn't exist and indicating that, in that case, I would be sad to go knowing that no return was possible.

When the time comes I shall very likely be calm and accepting, nothing Earthly will seem important to me anymore since all, including loved ones, will fade into the background with a "This is it then, here I go...".

Getting back to reincarnation, it would have been nice to see whether folk who believe in it imagine that we could come back not only as human but perhaps instead as an animal, an insect, even a tree/plant, or whatever else?

I've always thought I would like to be the wind gently rustling through the leaves of a tree, or whipping up the ocean waves, or whistling through the night while the little children sleep on...

Who knows but that little spider the nasty man trod on might come back as human while Mr big foot would return as a spider... sweet karma.
quote: "Link to reincarnation is not evident since I was replying to your theory that it probably doesn't exist....."


It seems you've misunderstood me - I hold and expressed no such theory. 

A point I made, though, is that reincarnation is probably different from the way many think of it.  I am persuaded that we may reincarnate but that it's not mandatory or necessarily routine - we make an informed, supported choice after we've returned 'home' when we're not constrained by the limited understanding we have here and now.

It's a bit of fun pretending "What if..." but I'm confident humankind doesn't return as a simpler form of life.
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Re: A Case Against Reincarnation

Post by Stardust on 22nd September 2017, 08:35

@mac wrote:
@Stardust wrote:
@mac wrote:I don't see how those comments relate to reincarnation as you haven't linked 'em to it in any way.

... You - we - don't know for sure how you or we will feel when the occasion eventually, inevitably, comes about. 
Link to reincarnation is not evident since I was replying to your theory that it probably doesn't exist and indicating that, in that case, I would be sad to go knowing that no return was possible.
...
Who knows but that little spider the nasty man trod on might come back as human while Mr big foot would return as a spider... sweet karma.
quote: "Link to reincarnation is not evident since I was replying to your theory that it probably doesn't exist....."

It seems you've misunderstood me - I hold and expressed no such theory. 

A point I made, though, is that reincarnation is probably different from the way many think of it.  I am persuaded that we may reincarnate but that it's not mandatory or necessarily routine - we make an informed, supported choice after we've returned 'home' when we're not constrained by the limited understanding we have here and now.

It's a bit of fun pretending "What if..." but I'm confident humankind doesn't return as a simpler form of life.
Sorry, mac, looks like I read the posts too quickly and misunderstood yours. I'll try to read more slowly another time.
very happy



A gentle whisper like the breeze sighing, so easy to miss, listen carefully...

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