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In the dark with Gary Mannion (finally exposed as FRAUD)

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Re: In the dark with Gary Mannion (finally exposed as FRAUD)

Post by Candlelight.kk on Mon 15 May 2017, 12:29 am

26 Aug 2016, 14:29

I made an edit to my post above re the Psychic News article.  (Not an edit to the article, I hasten to add! - that is reported word-for-word - but an add-in where I made reference (by asterisk) to two live chat videos made by Scott Milligan). 
Just to say that the one marked (Part 2) is the wrong video, and not related.

Here is the one that I should have made reference to:  https://www.facebook.com/scott.milligan.90/videos/10154353374713623/

This is quite a lovely video, as Scott's cat makes its presence known the whole way through :grin: (the first half) - kind of like it's presenting the video with him!   Such a gorgeous cat - and it's just the image of my lovely Pepsi who passed away a couple of years ago.
Specially funny is the cat's reaction when Scott uses the word 'catastrophic'.  rofl    Watch out for that bit - it's hilarious.

Apart from that, I'm finding that I really enjoy listening to this guy's interesting live chat videos.  I like the subjects that he covers and he does seem to know what he's talking about.

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Re: In the dark with Gary Mannion (finally exposed as FRAUD)

Post by mac on Mon 15 May 2017, 12:55 am

26 Aug 2016, 14:46

JDBP wrote:
mac wrote:Jon you need to sort yourself out.  Isn't it a nonsense for you to be demanding anything from anyone when your position is that all mediumship is fake?  Speaking about 'mediums' when you don't accept there are any is also illogical.

You are really saying that my opinion is a nonsense because I dont believe? You use the word nonsense when talking about mediumship and a skeptic, and the skeptic is the one you are using the word nonsense towards! lol.

No that's not what I'm saying.  I wrote what I intended to say.

JDBP wrote:OBVIOUSLY its all fake, and to demand anything of course its silly, I KNOW THAT< I am making a point to try and show believers how ridiculous the whole thing is, and that the fact that such demands are NOT being made by those on the inside, shows that they all know its a con.
We here, and others elsewhere, do understand what you believe to be the situation based on your experience.  Your bluster is seen for what it is - bluster.  You enjoy your chosen stance and will probably maintain it through thick and thin - kudos!  Generalisation is your forté - bully for you but we can see through it.  No matter....

JDBP wrote:Damn for a 70 year old man Keith you aint that bright sometimes!
I don't need to be bright, I'm only 69 and although my 10K performance has slowed, my mental capacity hasn't.  And there's really no need to try to be hurtful, Jon.  We can disagree without that.

JDBP wrote:After every major exposure or damaging event in spiritualism, its the same old thing.
  
But you don't care anyway!

JDBP wrote:I do care though, over a decade of exposing frauds, and helping victims of frauds proves I care, and if my voice starts a debate then it is worth doing.
I have never said say you don't care about exposing fraud but you don't care about its impact on Spiritualism - you mentioned it in that context.

JDBP wrote:You are someone who doesn't care, from the fact you have contributed to a fraudulent industry and have never done a single thing to expose it, or help victims.
So I contribute to a fraudulent industry do I Jon boy?  interesting....

JDBP wrote:At least I am hated by the frauds because i am a threat to them, remind me again why you are hated by everyone?

So I'm hated by everyone?  Oh you so know how to hurt!  I'm glad though that you're hated by frauds as they deserve all you give them.

JDBP wrote:...faked physical mediumship is still going on at Banyan and in full knowledge of Nic and the people "in the know"
 
To you ALL claimed mediumship is fake so what's special about Banyan?

JDBP wrote:Well for a start it is the topic of conversation regarding where Mannion got caught out, plus it hosts other fake mediums like David Thompson and they cover up his fraud clearly, since no videos of him have emerged! Funny that!

It's your position that there are no genuine mediums, Jon, so what's a "fake medium"?  Banyan isn't special because - using your approach - EVERY single venue must surely be equally culpable and equally deserving of your ire. 

JDBP wrote:Only an absolute gullible fool would believe in physical mediumship in the first place when all evidence is presented IN THE FREAKING DARK!
But then the gullible fool is kind of the exact kind of customer that spiritualism needs and wants.

As for Laraine Killarney, she can act as outraged as she wants, but fact remains she knowingly allows and promotes frauds at Stourbridge church!
 
To you all mediumship is fake so why single out physical mediumship?

JDBP wrote:Because when physical mediumship is exposed, even believers tend to accept the truth, because it is right there in front of them in video format.
If I expose a mental medium, then you can get all manner of excuses like
"they were having a bad day"
"mediums cant perform on demand"
"Thats only your opinion"
"there is no way they could have known blah blah blah when I got a reading"
ALL mediumship is fake, Jon, according to you.  Differences are meaningless if all is fraud.

JDBP wrote:And so on, the excuses are endless, however only a real real idiot defends a physical medium when they get caught cheating.
I loved the excuses I heard after Colin Fry got caught cheating, the cover up by the Psychic News back then was hilarious, and that was after they broke the story too.

That is my largest problem with all of this, the hypocrisy, and damage control from all corners, the truth is that Mannion is probably the person to blame the least for his fraud!

Why do YOU have any problem with others' failings as you consider them?  Others carry responsibility if they've failed to act appropriately but you are in no special position to judge their motives.

JDBP wrote:I disagree, I am perfectly position to judge their motives, since I am the single most knowledgeable and experienced person in the genre in the UK. No one comes close to me, seriously ego aside, can you name one person in the UK who even comes close to my knowledge and experience on this subject?
You are knowledgeable and experienced in a narrow field of expertise I readily accept but that doesn't put you in a special position to judge someone's motives.

Blame for the fraud is, however, the responsibility of Mannion and anyone who knowingly supported him in that fraud.

JDBP wrote:So Banyan are to blame then, especially as they were blackmailing Mannion, and were happy to COVER IT UP as long as Mannion did what they said, everyone seems to miss that one very important point dont they!
Not me, you cant get anything past me!
We can all judge for ourselves who deserves blame.  You're not unique in seeing where it should lie.

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Re: In the dark with Gary Mannion (finally exposed as FRAUD)

Post by JDBP on Mon 15 May 2017, 12:57 am

26 Aug 2016, 19:21

I wonder are you guys aware of Plato's Allegory of the Cave.
If not you should. As it fits the difference between you the wall watchers and me the free man

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Re: In the dark with Gary Mannion (finally exposed as FRAUD)

Post by mac on Mon 15 May 2017, 12:58 am

26 Aug 2016, 20:14

Have you heard the one that goes "None so blind as those who choose not to see."? If you hadn't before you have now.

Enjoy the freedom you think you have but reflect that none of us incarnates is ever a totally free woman or man and none can be certain she, or he, is not the wall-watcher.

Are you sure you're not the frying pan calling the kettle black?

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Re: In the dark with Gary Mannion (finally exposed as FRAUD)

Post by JDBP on Mon 15 May 2017, 1:00 am

27 Aug 2016, 10:05

mac wrote:
Have you heard the one that goes "None so blind as those who choose not to see."? If you hadn't before you have now.

Enjoy the freedom you think you have but reflect that none of us incarnates is ever a totally free woman or man and none can be certain she, or he, is not the wall-watcher.

Are you sure you're not the frying pan calling the kettle black?


I have been the believer, I have been the wall watcher, and I walked away from the wall and saw what created the shadows.
You are still looking at the shadows and trusting your imagination.

And the quote "None so blind as those who choose not to see.", is a perfect fit for those who believe in mediums.

Plato really got it spot on with what it is like for me to talk to the wall watchers like you.
No much explaining, debunking and so on will ever get through to you, until you decide to remove your bonds and turn around.

Remember most if not all skeptics started out wall watching, difference is we turned around, and saw what created the shadows.

And with that once again, the great one leaves with one simple action.....

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Re: In the dark with Gary Mannion (finally exposed as FRAUD)

Post by Candlelight.kk on Mon 15 May 2017, 1:10 am

27 Aug 2016, 10:36

JDBP wrote:I wonder are you guys aware of Plato's Allegory of the Cave.
If not you should. As it fits the difference between you the wall watchers and me the free man

Spoiler:
Allegory of the Cave:

Plato's allegory of the cave is one of the best-known, most insightful attempts to explain the nature of reality. The cave represents the state of most human beings, and the tale of a dramatic exit from the cave is the source of true understanding.

Plato's Philosophy of Reality

Everyone who has ever lived has asked some version of the same question, at some point in life: Why are we here? What is the point of all this? What is 'reality,' and what am I supposed to do with (or about) it?

Plato, a famous Greek philosopher who wrote the Allegory of the Cave, attempted to answer some of these philosophical questions, most notably about the nature of reality. He tells the 'Allegory of the Cave' as a conversation between his mentor, Socrates, who inspired many of Plato's philosophical theories, and one of Socrates' students, Glaucon.

The Theory of Forms

One of Socrates' (and Plato's) chief ideas was that of forms, which explains that the world is made up of reflections of more perfect and ideal forms. The material world, the one we can see, touch, hear and smell, is really just half-seen images of the reality of the forms. Relying on your physical senses alone - trusting what you see, for instance, is, to Socrates, making yourself effectively blind. The world we see is only a reflection of the forms the world represents (and not even that accurately). A form, whether it's a circle, or a table, or a tree or a dog, is, for Socrates, the answer to the question, What is that? Only understanding forms can lead to true knowledge.

Plato uses a parable, a short informative story, to illustrate 'forms' and the 'cave,' in his main work, The Republic (which first appeared around 380 BC).

The Allegory of the Cave

The dialogue between Socrates and Glaucon is probably fictitious and composed by Plato; whether or not the allegory originated with Socrates, or if Plato is using his mentor as a stand-in for his own idea, is unclear.

In the dialogue, Socrates asks Glaucon to imagine a cave, in which prisoners are kept. These prisoners have been in the cave since their childhood, and each of them is held there in a peculiar manner. They are all chained so that their legs and necks are immobile, forced to look at a wall in front of them. Behind the prisoners is a fire and between the fire and the prisoners is a raised walkway, on which people can walk.

These people are puppeteers, and they are carrying objects, in the shape of human and animal figures, as well as everyday items. The prisoners could only see these flickering images on the wall, since they could not move their heads; and so, naturally enough, they presumed the images to be real, rather than just shadowy representations of what is actually real.

In fact, Socrates claimed, the images on the wall would be so real that the prisoners would assign prestige among each other to the one who could recall the most detail about the shapes, the order in which they appeared and which might typically be found together or in tandem. Of course, Socrates would point out, this was hollow praise, since in fact the images were not real.

Then Socrates offered a twist in the plot - what if one of the prisoners were to be freed and made to turn and look at the fire? The bright light would hurt his eyes, as accustomed as he was to the shadows, and even in turning back to the wall and its flickering images (which would be only natural), the prisoner couldn't help but notice that they weren't real at all, but only shadows of the real items on the walkway behind him.

If the prisoner was then taken from the cave and brought into the open, the disorientation would be even more severe; the light of the sun would be much more brilliant than the fire. But, as his eyes adjusted, the newly freed prisoner would be able to see beyond only shadows; he would see dimensions and reflections in the water (even of himself).

After learning of the reality of the world, the prisoner now sees how 'pitiable' his former colleagues in the cave really are. If he returned to the cave and rejoined them, he would take no pleasure in their accolades or praise for knowledge of the shadow-figures. For their own part, the prisoners would see him as deranged, not really knowing what reality is and would say of him that he left the cave and returned with corrupted eyes.

Socrates' (and Plato's) point is that, once we understand what reality is (the forms), it is the job of the informed to lead the ignorant 'out of the cave' and into true knowledge. This means, of course, that those who still are uninformed will resist, since, after all, the cave is all they've ever known. But, this doesn't change the obligation of the enlightened philosopher to try (and keep trying) to help his fellow citizens.
Discussion and Explanation

The allegory not only draws on the theory of forms, but it is connected both to the concept of forms and Plato's theory of the stages of life.
http://study.com/academy/lesson/the-allegory-of-the-cave-by-plato-summary-analysis-explanation.html

Putting yourself in the position of "the free man" does not in itself put you in a position of 100% knowledge of 'reality'. 
In effect, the "free man", now outside of the cave ,(if he does not investigate further), finds himself in a very small and lonely world of his own - where his perception of all things appear [to him] to be the 'be-all-and-end-all' of all knowledge, which is merely his, and his alone, perception from where he now stands (and remains!).
There are many more angles, possibilities and discoveries to be delved into and applied to this allegory.  Think about it ... really think ....

PS:   "None so blind as those who choose not to see" is actually the perfect fit for "the free man" who remains where he is, and chooses not to see any further!

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Re: In the dark with Gary Mannion (finally exposed as FRAUD)

Post by mac on Mon 15 May 2017, 1:16 am

27 Aug 2016, 13:30

JDBP wrote:

mac wrote:
Have you heard the one that goes "None so blind as those who choose not to see."? If you hadn't before you have now.

Enjoy the freedom you think you have but reflect that none of us incarnates is ever a totally free woman or man and none can be certain she, or he, is not the wall-watcher.

Are you sure you're not the frying pan calling the kettle black?


I have been the believer, I have been the wall watcher, and I walked away from the wall and saw what created the shadows.
You are still looking at the shadows and trusting your imagination.

And the quote "None so blind as those who choose not to see.", is a perfect fit for those who believe in mediums.

Plato really got it spot on with what it is like for me to talk to the wall watchers like you.
No much explaining, debunking and so on will ever get through to you, until you decide to remove your bonds and turn around.

Remember most if not all skeptics started out wall watching, difference is we turned around, and saw what created the shadows.

And with that once again, the great one leaves with one simple action.....



You display certainty (as you see it) about others that appears as myopic as you would (likely) declare others to be. So be it.

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Re: In the dark with Gary Mannion (finally exposed as FRAUD)

Post by mac on Mon 15 May 2017, 1:17 am

27 Aug 2016, 13:32

"Plato really got it spot on with what it is like for me to talk to the wall watchers like you.
No much explaining, debunking and so on will ever get through to you, until you decide to remove your bonds and turn around."


Yet you continue to return to this inconsequential forum and its misled individuals. One day the truth will out why that is so....

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Re: In the dark with Gary Mannion (finally exposed as FRAUD)

Post by mac on Mon 15 May 2017, 1:18 am

27 Aug 2016, 14:04

Enough, now, and to repeat my point, I'm glad to see that some have denounced Mannion and some have resolved never to allow him to perform on their premises again. By doing that it should indicate that what he does is no part of Spiritualism - at best it's phenomenalism and at worse it's simple fraud.

It doesn't, of course, prevent Mannion from promoting himself and using regular commercial venues but it's a start on limiting the deception he appears to have been displaying for some time. Better late than never but a shame it was allowed to continue as long as it has.
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Re: In the dark with Gary Mannion (finally exposed as FRAUD)

Post by Candlelight.kk on Mon 15 May 2017, 1:21 am

02 Oct 2016, 17:31

Time for action

Psychic News' TRUTH campaign for thermal testing of physical mediums gets major backing from three continents



In a dramatic move designed to verify the genuineness of physical mediumship and, at the same time, rid Spiritualism of charlatans pretending to produce physical phenomena, Psychic News has joined forces with the Spiritualists' National Union (SNU) and the Banyan Retreat to change perceptions and challenge the procedures surrounding such séances.

This informal coalition follows the exposure of Gary Mannion's blatant fraud, revealed by covert infrared filming of his "physical mediumship" at Banyan Retreat, Kent [PN July, August and September 2016] earlier this year.

His ability to fool many people poses serious questions about the involvement of Spiritualist churches - some of them SNU members - and independent centres in unwittingly exposing their followers to fraudulent activities.

It's difficult to know if Mannion once had some genuine physical mediumship ability, but as his physical séances for three years or more have followed the same pattern as the "séance" caught on video, this is now being questioned.

Physical mediums have produced some spectacular results over the years, manifesting remarkable phenomena combined with impressive evidence of life after death.
But even the best have been accused of fraud - often unjustifiably, it seems - by sceptics who refuse to believe such things are possible.

The major problem with most accounts of materialisations and other ectoplasmic phenomena is that they usually occur in darkness or in low light conditions, often making eyewitness accounts less than reliable.

Psychic News believes it is now time for Spiritualists around the world to unit in stamping out fraud by utilising new technology before the activities of fake physical mediums like Mannion do long-lasting damage to the Movement.

As a first step, we are campaigning for every physical medium who demonstrates publicly to be tested using the latest, non-invasive thermal technology. We are also inviting all Spiritualist churches and centres to give their support to this campaign by agreeing to allow only those physical mediums, whose abilities have been verified by thermal imaging technology to demonstrate on their premises.

For more details, check out pages 34 - 38 of Psychic News, October 2016 issue

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Re: In the dark with Gary Mannion (finally exposed as FRAUD)

Post by JDBP on Mon 15 May 2017, 1:22 am

02 Oct 2016, 17:49

Not sure what to think of this. is The Psychic news really so naive that they think that physical mediumship has ever been real? Of course it is not.
Only takes one "real" medium to let himself be filmed to prove it all, yet they never do.

How about this for a prediction. NOTHING will happen. Mediums will refuse to be filmed. They will keep doing their in the dark seances, and move away from any group that insists on filming it.

Everyone from David Thompson to Stewart Alexander, to the rest of the frauds at Banyan will NEVER EVER EVER allow themselves to be filmed with any kind of quality camera. They will use every excuse imaginable to avoid it, make up stuff that their imaginary "spirit team" have told them. And they will keep doing their 100+ year old parlour tricks.

So yeah a pointless PR exercise by the Psychic News that will achieve nothing.

I really hope I am proved wrong, but as everyone on here knows, I am never wrong in such matters

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Re: In the dark with Gary Mannion (finally exposed as FRAUD)

Post by mac on Mon 15 May 2017, 1:25 am

02 Oct 2016, 18:29

Ignoring the JD impersonator's usual blather....I really must settle down and read the October edition of Psychic News. I have a digital subscription and being the old geezer I am ( ) I prefer a piece of printed paper to a computer or tablet screen. JDI mac!
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Re: In the dark with Gary Mannion (finally exposed as FRAUD)

Post by Candlelight.kk on Mon 15 May 2017, 1:26 am

02 Oct 2016, 18:56

mac wrote:
Ignoring the JD impersonator's usual blather....I really must settle down and read the October edition of Psychic News. I have a digital subscription and being the old geezer I am ( ) I prefer a piece of printed paper to a computer or tablet screen. JDI mac!


You can always do like I do, mac - print out specific pages/articles from the digital version. That way you've got the best of both worlds.

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Re: In the dark with Gary Mannion (finally exposed as FRAUD)

Post by mac on Mon 15 May 2017, 1:28 am

02 Oct 2016, 20:49

Candlelight.kk wrote:

mac wrote:
Ignoring the JD impersonator's usual blather....I really must settle down and read the October edition of Psychic News. I have a digital subscription and being the old geezer I am ( ) I prefer a piece of printed paper to a computer or tablet screen. JDI mac!

You can always do like I do, mac - print out specific pages/articles from the digital version. That way you've got the best of both worlds.

Yes you're right and I think that must be the way for me when there's a particular article I'm interested in. I've just read the TRUTH piece on a tablet which is less onerous than the computer screen and the piece on Paul gaunt is interesting and talks a little about a church which is just next door to where I live so I'm going to print that and read it again.

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Re: In the dark with Gary Mannion (finally exposed as FRAUD)

Post by JDBP on Mon 15 May 2017, 1:30 am

02 Oct 2016, 20:50

Why blather? Which part of what I wrote is not true?

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Re: In the dark with Gary Mannion (finally exposed as FRAUD)

Post by mac on Mon 15 May 2017, 1:32 am

02 Oct 2016, 20:54

JDBP wrote:
Why blather? Which part of what I wrote is not true?
It looked like all your other blather so I didn't read it. I don't give trolls my time nowadays....

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Re: In the dark with Gary Mannion (finally exposed as FRAUD)

Post by JDBP on Mon 15 May 2017, 1:34 am

02 Oct 2016, 20:57

This so called troll is the only one who speaks sense on here.

Brother Keith I knew you'd come.

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Re: In the dark with Gary Mannion (finally exposed as FRAUD)

Post by mac on Mon 15 May 2017, 1:36 am

02 Oct 2016, 21:11

JDBP wrote:
This so called troll is the only one who speaks sense on here.

Brother Keith I knew you'd come.

Trolls often seed nonsense with snippets of fact to trap the unwary and love to name-drop.

Jon Donnis declares on his website that he writes only on his own website hence you're an impostor. I'm sure he'd let us know if he started to write elsewhere. What might his followers think if they found he'd been disingenuous?

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Re: In the dark with Gary Mannion (finally exposed as FRAUD)

Post by JDBP on Mon 15 May 2017, 1:38 am

02 Oct 2016, 21:45

Who is Jon Donnis? I'm JDBP

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Re: In the dark with Gary Mannion (finally exposed as FRAUD)

Post by mac on Mon 15 May 2017, 1:39 am

02 Oct 2016, 21:48

JDBP wrote:
Who is Jon Donnis?I'm JDBP

Then I shall disregard what you write as JDBP.

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Re: In the dark with Gary Mannion (finally exposed as FRAUD)

Post by JDBP on Mon 15 May 2017, 1:40 am

02 Oct 2016, 21:50

Never disregard a legend like me.

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Re: In the dark with Gary Mannion (finally exposed as FRAUD)

Post by mac on Mon 15 May 2017, 1:41 am

02 Oct 2016, 22:51

JDBP wrote:
Never disregard a legend like me.
It's just your belief you're a legend.

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Re: In the dark with Gary Mannion (finally exposed as FRAUD)

Post by JDBP on Mon 15 May 2017, 1:43 am

03 Oct 2016, 07:09

Belief that is equal in credibility than any claim of any psychic

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Re: In the dark with Gary Mannion (finally exposed as FRAUD)

Post by mac on Mon 15 May 2017, 1:45 am

03 Oct 2016, 09:40

JDBP wrote:
Belief that is equal in credibility than any claim of any psychic
I don't doubt your own belief in your own self has indeed as much credibility - for you - as the claim of any psychic but I don't have much interest in either.   trumpet
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Re: In the dark with Gary Mannion (finally exposed as FRAUD)

Post by Candlelight.kk on Mon 15 May 2017, 1:50 am

03 Oct 2016, 11:51

mac wrote:the piece on Paul gaunt is interesting

I was already aware of the invaluable and meticulously researched work carried out by Paul J. Gaunt (together with Leslie Price) in producing the excellent 'Psypioneer Journal' - but it was only through reading that article in this month's Psychic News, that I discovered this new publication that he has created - 'Pioneer' - which has actually been going for some time now.

I have now collated together all the editions of Pioneer from conception and they are all available for full reading in the Read Online Library section of the Forum - HERE: http://lightafterlife.freeforums.org/post6696.html?hilit=#p6696

I will add new issues as and when they become available.

(Not read through every issue myself yet (been too busy collating them all together), but looking forward to doing so when I can get the time)

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Re: In the dark with Gary Mannion (finally exposed as FRAUD)

Post by mac on Mon 15 May 2017, 1:53 am

03 Oct 2016, 14:10

Candlelight.kk wrote:

mac wrote:
the piece on Paul gaunt is interesting

I was already aware of the invaluable and meticulously researched work carried out by Paul J. Gaunt (together with Leslie Price) in producing the excellent 'Psypioneer Journal' - but it was only through reading that article in this month's Psychic News, that I discovered this new publication that he has created - 'Pioneer' - which has actually been going for some time now.

I have now collated together all the editions of Pioneer from conception and they are all available for full reading in the Read Online Library section of the Forum - HERE: http://lightafterlife.freeforums.org/post6696.html?hilit=#p6696.

I will add new issues as and when they become available.

(Not read through every issue myself yet (been too busy collating them all together), but looking forward to doing so when I can get the time)


great job, kk! I'll take a look at your compilation later.  wave

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Re: In the dark with Gary Mannion (finally exposed as FRAUD)

Post by JDBP on Mon 15 May 2017, 1:56 am

06 Oct 2016, 20:40

mac wrote:
JDBP wrote:Belief that is equal in credibility than any claim of any psychic
I don't doubt your own belief in your own self has indeed as much credibility - for you - as the claim of any psychic but I don't have much interest in either.     trumpet

Nice that you agree with me about the credibility of any claim by any medium.

I am curious, do you believe that Cathy has any magical powers?

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Re: In the dark with Gary Mannion (finally exposed as FRAUD)

Post by mac on Mon 15 May 2017, 1:57 am

06 Oct 2016, 21:52

"I am curious, do you believe that Cathy has any magical powers?" Do you have reason to believe she has?

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Re: In the dark with Gary Mannion (finally exposed as FRAUD)

Post by JDBP on Mon 15 May 2017, 1:59 am

06 Oct 2016, 21:55

mac wrote:
"I am curious, do you believe that Cathy has any magical powers?" Do you have reason to believe she has?


No, I am skeptical of her claims. I thought that was clear?
But nice little deflect there

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Re: In the dark with Gary Mannion (finally exposed as FRAUD)

Post by mac on Mon 15 May 2017, 2:02 am

06 Oct 2016, 22:11

JDBP wrote:
mac wrote:"I am curious, do you believe that Cathy has any magical powers?" Do you have reason to believe she has?

No, I am skeptical of her claims. I thought that was clear?
But nice little deflect there

For utmost clarity it never hurts to re-state what you believe and what you don't. Why not run your question by Mr Jinx?  You'll find him on the magic forum on Jon Donnis's website.  It's a very entertaining section...   very happy

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Re: In the dark with Gary Mannion (finally exposed as FRAUD)

Post by JDBP on Mon 15 May 2017, 2:04 am

07 Oct 2016, 10:08

mac wrote:
JDBP wrote:
mac wrote:"I am curious, do you believe that Cathy has any magical powers?" Do you have reason to believe she has?

No, I am skeptical of her claims. I thought that was clear?
But nice little deflect there

For utmost clarity it never hurts to re-state what you believe and what you don't. Why not run your question by Mr Jinx?  You'll find him on the magic forum on Jon Donnis's website.  It's a very entertaining section...   very happy

So you refuse to answer any questions, funny how both you and Cathy do that, then moan at me when you claim I dont answer a question despite me clearly asking to repeat question and I will answer it.

This is where you guys really fall down.

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Re: In the dark with Gary Mannion (finally exposed as FRAUD)

Post by mac on Mon 15 May 2017, 2:06 am

07 Oct 2016, 10:27

JDBP wrote:
mac wrote:
JDBP wrote:
mac wrote:"I am curious, do you believe that Cathy has any magical powers?" Do you have reason to believe she has?

No, I am skeptical of her claims. I thought that was clear?
But nice little deflect there

For utmost clarity it never hurts to re-state what you believe and what you don't. Why not run your question by Mr Jinx?  You'll find him on the magic forum on Jon Donnis's website.  It's a very entertaining section...   :grin:

So you refuse to answer any questions, funny how both you and Cathy do that, then moan at me when you claim I dont answer a question despite me clearly asking to repeat question and I will answer it.

This is where you guys really fall down.

Ah, poor little lovey, no-one's gonna do what the big, bad Jon Donnis impersonator expects 'em to do  - oh, shame....  happyheart

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Re: In the dark with Gary Mannion (finally exposed as FRAUD)

Post by JDBP on Mon 15 May 2017, 2:09 am

07 Oct 2016, 10:34

mac wrote:
JDBP wrote:
mac wrote:
JDBP wrote:
mac wrote:"I am curious, do you believe that Cathy has any magical powers?" Do you have reason to believe she has?

No, I am skeptical of her claims. I thought that was clear?
But nice little deflect there

For utmost clarity it never hurts to re-state what you believe and what you don't. Why not run your question by Mr Jinx?  You'll find him on the magic forum on Jon Donnis's website.  It's a very entertaining section...   :grin:

So you refuse to answer any questions, funny how both you and Cathy do that, then moan at me when you claim I dont answer a question despite me clearly asking to repeat question and I will answer it.

This is where you guys really fall down.

Ah, poor little lovey, no-one's gonna do what the big, bad Jon Donnis impersonator expects 'em to do  - oh, shame.... happyheart

I dont claim to be this Jon Donnis character you mention. JDBP stands for Jack Daniels British Perfection

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Re: In the dark with Gary Mannion (finally exposed as FRAUD)

Post by mac on Mon 15 May 2017, 2:13 am

07 Oct 2016, 10:47

JDBP wrote:
I dont claim to be this Jon Donnis character you mention. JDBP stands for Jack Daniels British Perfection

And I didn't say you do claim to be him.  You've said previously that you're JDBP.   Jon Donnis declares he doesn't write on any other website and I accept that.  Plainly you can't be him. 

I wrote "...Jon Donnis impersonator..." because that's what I see you as on account of the impression you give me.  very happy    Still not gonna do what you want, though.....
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Re: In the dark with Gary Mannion (finally exposed as FRAUD)

Post by Candlelight.kk on Mon 15 May 2017, 2:14 am

07 Oct 2016, 10:53

JDBP wrote:
JDBP stands for Jack Daniels British Perfection


Oh really? I always thought it stood for Just Dozy Bull***t Peddler.

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Re: In the dark with Gary Mannion (finally exposed as FRAUD)

Post by JDBP on Mon 15 May 2017, 2:17 am

07 Oct 2016, 11:03

Candlelight.kk wrote:

JDBP wrote:
JDBP stands for Jack Daniels British Perfection

Oh really? I always thought it stood for Just Dozy Bull***t Peddler.

Said the woman who sits in the dark, putting on silly voices, pretending to be dead sailors, and then asking for MONEY for doing it!
Awkward! #PWND
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Re: In the dark with Gary Mannion (finally exposed as FRAUD)

Post by Candlelight.kk on Mon 15 May 2017, 2:18 am

07 Oct 2016, 11:24

JDBP wrote:
Said the woman who sits in the dark, putting on silly voices, pretending to be dead sailors, and then asking for MONEY for doing it!
Awkward! #PWND


Yep! A perfect example of Just Dozy Bull***t Peddler!
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Re: In the dark with Gary Mannion (finally exposed as FRAUD)

Post by Misty on Mon 15 May 2017, 2:21 am

02 Nov 2016, 18:16

Misty wrote:
JDBP wrote:
Whiskers wrote:
Candlelight.kk wrote:By the way, I wonder if anyone has noticed (?) - in the video where Gary is pulling out people's chairs (the third video), at one stage, about half way through (02:32), a very visible ball of light sweeps quite fast but smoothly across the room from the right, hovers for a moment outside the cabinet and then appears to swoop into the cabinet.  I wonder what that's all about.

I looked at it 3 times now KK.  Its an orb!  No way is that dust or a fly or insect.  It goes straight to the cabinet and disappears.  Spooky!

You see what you done now Cath! You made the forum 20% dumber, and I never thought that was even possible!

Instead of making smarty pants remarks, why dont you just say what you think it is JDBP?  I genuinely dont have any idea of what else it could be and would like to know what are the possibilities and to hear from other people what their ideas are. 
I personally rule out dust or insect, neither move in that way, so what else do we look at?  why cant you just give us your ideas instead of being smug and smarmy.

JDBP wrote:ps. Just looked, and it is a bit of out of focus crap in the air near to the lens, within the focal point which gives it its orb like appearance.
Probably a bit of dust or something floating on the air current in the room, Im guessing it was pretty hot in there lots of people breathing, and so on. Doesn't help the camera quality is crap, it is a digital video so lots of digital artifacts spoiling things too.

But as a photographic expert (18 years experience), I can say with 100% certainty it is not an orb, or an alien, it is just a bit of crap in the air, close to the camera lens.

Ok happy now? no need to call Captain Disillusion. It can safely be ignored.

JDBP, I am not at all convinced by your explanation that "it is just a bit o crap in the air, close to the camera lens".  Its definately not dust and its not an insect because neither of them move in that smooth directed way.  And if its "crap close to the camera lens" why does it disappear when it goes into the cabinet???

Its a pity there has not been more people here giving observations on what they think it might be, someone with photographic skills might be able to break it down and find out a bit more ---- I dunno, slow motion or something?  I dont have such expertise but until an expert can show me absolute scientific proof of what it is I can only assume its a spirit form of some sort in that room.

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Re: In the dark with Gary Mannion (finally exposed as FRAUD)

Post by JDBP on Mon 15 May 2017, 2:23 am

02 Nov 2016, 18:19

So your position is that it must be ghosts if no one can say otherwise.

Ok it is 100% a spirit. There ya go. Prrof that spirits exist and all of science is wrong.
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Re: In the dark with Gary Mannion (finally exposed as FRAUD)

Post by Misty on Mon 15 May 2017, 2:25 am

02 Nov 2016, 18:36

JDBP wrote:
So your position is that it must be ghosts if no one can say otherwise.

Ok it is 100% a spirit. There ya go. Prrof that spirits exist and all of science is wrong.

If you or anyone else can prove scientifically what that is in the video then I will accept it. There must be ways that photographic experts can provide this proof. It wouldnt be a hard task for anyone to do if they have the knowledge and the technology!

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Re: In the dark with Gary Mannion (finally exposed as FRAUD)

Post by JDBP on Mon 15 May 2017, 2:27 am

02 Nov 2016, 18:38

Well as a photographic expert I thought I knew. But now listening to your infallible logic and reasoning I believe that everything I know about photography and science must be wrong so I agree with you. Its 100% a real spirit.
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Re: In the dark with Gary Mannion (finally exposed as FRAUD)

Post by Misty on Mon 15 May 2017, 2:29 am

02 Nov 2016, 18:41

JDBP wrote:
Well as a photographic expert I thought I knew. But now listening to your infallible logic and reasoning I believe that everything I know about photography and science must be wrong so I agree with you. Its 100% a real spirit.

ok so you might "know" yourself but can you show to a non-expert HOW you know that. Show a breakdown of the video or something??
Unless you can do that then its only your OPINION of what it is.

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Re: In the dark with Gary Mannion (finally exposed as FRAUD)

Post by JDBP on Mon 15 May 2017, 2:31 am

02 Nov 2016, 18:49

Not sure I'm making myself clear here. I agree with you it 100% shows spirit. I'm just writing up my paper now which I will submit to all the science magazines. How the UKs most experienced and knowledgeably expert on the paranormal was wrong about ghosts because some random teenager called Misty decided that the paranormal explanation was more Likely just 'cause'.

I better contact all the worlds media too that have quoted me regarding everything from sea monsters, Bigfoot and UFOs too. Cause clearly they all exist too and my knowledge is flawed.

"Spirit life proven cause something that looks like a bit of out if focus crap near the lens was less likely than a manifesting spirit of the dead"

I better call Stephen Hawking too, hell have to recall all his books, how embarrassing, the worlds smartest man having to recall all his books cause of Misty an Internet noobie, who has turned common sense upside down.
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Re: In the dark with Gary Mannion (finally exposed as FRAUD)

Post by Misty on Mon 15 May 2017, 2:34 am

02 Nov 2016, 19:00

lol  rofl   That reply is proof enough for me that you really havent got a clue. If you were really a photographic expert as you say, you would be jumping at the chance to show proof and details of why the idea of it being a paranormal connection is so way off the mark.

I genuinely wanted to know --- from someone who knows their stuff, but obviously thats not you. blah


and BTW, its a long time since I was a teenager. If only ..............

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Re: In the dark with Gary Mannion (finally exposed as FRAUD)

Post by JDBP on Mon 15 May 2017, 2:35 am

02 Nov 2016, 19:02

I've already explained. I have no interest in drawing diagrams, making photos and videos just to explain to a gullible teenager on a dead forum. My original explanation was detailed enough for anyone with half a brain to understand.

So how about this, can you prove it is paranormal? After all you are making the claim therefore the onus is on you to prove it.
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Re: In the dark with Gary Mannion (finally exposed as FRAUD)

Post by Misty on Mon 15 May 2017, 2:40 am

02 Nov 2016, 19:04

No I am not making a claim, I am ASKING A QUESTION --- and just getting BS for an answer.

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Re: In the dark with Gary Mannion (finally exposed as FRAUD)

Post by JDBP on Mon 15 May 2017, 2:41 am

02 Nov 2016, 19:08

I've answered you. Its an out if focus artifact close to the lens of the camera its a common problem with digital video. 100% acceptable explanation. And would never be questioned by anyone with any photographic knowledge. Hell even the psych wannabe owner of this forum will agree with me and her lapdog Mac.

Why can't you accept this?
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Re: In the dark with Gary Mannion (finally exposed as FRAUD)

Post by Misty on Mon 15 May 2017, 2:43 am

02 Nov 2016, 19:17

JDBP wrote:
I've answered you. Its an out if focus artifact close to the lens of the camera its a common problem with digital video. 100% acceptable explanation. And would never be questioned by anyone with any photographic knowledge. Hell even the psych wannabe owner of this forum will agree with me and her lapdog Mac.

Why can't you accept this?


For the same reason you cant accept a paranormal explanation for it -- i.e. NO PROOF! If 100% proof is easily available why cant you provide it?

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Re: In the dark with Gary Mannion (finally exposed as FRAUD)

Post by JDBP on Mon 15 May 2017, 2:44 am

02 Nov 2016, 19:25

Because I don't care. I'm not claiming anything magical. Whether I spend hours making a video explaining how all this works or not it makes no difference. Already 99.9% of the worlds photographers will agree with me, and 99.9% of credible scientists. I literally have no interest in proving I am right as only an idiot would say otherwise.

Its like you asking me to prove bananas are yellow. What's the point when everyone e with eyes already agrees with me.

You prove me wrong and I'll listen. Find me one professional photographer that disagrees with me and I'll spend the time to fully debunk it.

Seriously go to any photography forum in the world show them that video and that you think its proof if spirit and if just one credible photographer agrees with you. Then I'll spend the time to make a video to explain it. How's that sound?

PS. when on those forums listen to them as they'll say the same thing as me. Surely we can't all be wrong can we.

That's it. I'm done with this discussion as its beneath me
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Re: In the dark with Gary Mannion (finally exposed as FRAUD)

Post by Candlelight.kk on Mon 15 May 2017, 2:48 am

03 Nov 2016, 13:47

Oh dear, I can see (and feel) both your frustrations in this (misty and JDBP).  I guess it's my fault for bringing up the subject here in the first place.  It was just a general observation on my part, and I just wondered if anyone else had noticed it and what their thoughts on it were.
If you don't ask the questions, you can't expect to get answers - and depending on where those questions are posed will result in the type of answers you will get! 

Misty gave her thoughts on what she thought it might be.  JDBP jumped straight in accusing Misty of being a blind-believer teenage newbie (which I know for a fact she is definitely NOT).  Unfortunately, no-one else has come forth with any ideas or explanations, so we are left with a bit of a stalemate.

Here is a video showing what dust looks like when captured on moving film: 



The 'orb' in the Mannion video certainly seems to be typical of one of those dust particles - and yet as Misty pointed out - if it were actually dust, why was there only one of them (one particle of dust?) and why did it appear to make a swoop down straight into the cabinet and disappear there ...(?)
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Re: In the dark with Gary Mannion (finally exposed as FRAUD)

Post by Candlelight.kk on Mon 15 May 2017, 2:49 am

04 Mar 2017, 00:14

Thread BUMPED - lest it be forgotten!

Gary is still working in Australia, Norway and various places in the UK.

http://www.afterlifeagents.com/psychic-surgery

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Re: In the dark with Gary Mannion (finally exposed as FRAUD)

Post by mac on Mon 15 May 2017, 2:56 am

04 Mar 2017, 08:45

Amazing how folk will ignore what's inconvenient!

    Current date/time is Tue 22 Aug 2017, 10:03 am